SIGIA-L Mail Archives: SIG-IA Web development: databases and dy
SIG-IA Web development: databases and dynamically generated pages
From: David Robert Austen (dausten_at_customerscience.com)
Date: Tue Feb 13 2001 - 09:08:35 EST
Thanks for getting this ball rolling, Stacy,
I will look carefully at the results of the survey of SIG-IA member
user needs survey and see what may be the best use of this technology
at the early stages in our Web development.
By the way, any "devil's advocates" are more than welcome to step
forward at this point, and tell us of your experiences with the
development process, software, and with systems or information
architecture etc.
I worked on a successful Cold Fusion project at one point but it was
eons ago.
David Robert Austen
SS> Particular greetings to the participants in this discussion on databases,
SS> IA, and dynamically generated sites.
SS> I would be interested in taking up David Robert Austen's and Ed Housman's
SS> challenges. It might make sense to use the SIGIA website as a workshop for
SS> investigating, recording, and reporting how-to (as we figure that out) and
SS> best practices (as uncovered through our research). There are, of course, a
SS> couple of issues to work out before committing to making the SIGIA website a
SS> database-driven site - this could be quite a big job, and not something
SS> anyone would want to leave half done. But, then, it might be PERFECT to
SS> gather our resources and apply them to a project like this. Then we could
SS> use this info at an ASIS+T session or other venue, and in our own work.
SS> I volunteer for... something more than cheerleader and something less than
SS> technical lead. Perhaps lead volunteers could kindly step forward?
SS> ~Stacy
SS> David Robert Austen wrote:
SS> Greetings, all:
SS> Relational database design is one of my skills, and if there is
SS> somebody out there with recent experience in database-to-Web
SS> application building, well, we could do something really useful
SS> together while we discuss this area of the IA discipline. We could
SS> have a laboratory, so to speak, on the SIG-IA site.
SS> The SIGIA Web will be much easier to update if we can run a database
SS> in the background, rather than build and update a lot of separate web
SS> pages. There will be a great opportunity for experience here.
SS> Please let me know if this interests you. We can use both experienced
SS> people who would lead that development and less-experienced people who
SS> will have to roll their sleeves up.
SS> David Robert Austen
RH>> [Forwarded. Dick Hill]
SS> -----Original Message-----
SS> From: Edward M. Housman [mailto:emh_at_mitre.org]
SS> Sent: Thursday, February 08, 2001 10:47 AM
SS> To: spcoon_at_mindspring.com
SS> Cc: Surla, Stacy; sigia-l_at_asis.org
SS> Subject: Re: SIGIA-L: Architectecting of Databases
SS> Y'know this flood of interest in databases behind AI products is
SS> interesting, and I am trying to figger out how to harness this
SS> interest. I have asked Stacy to come up with some ideas in this area,
SS> how SIG/IA can mobilize to do something useful for our membership here.
SS> I told her perhaps we should have a database shindig somewhere for peers
SS> to thrash out the problems and maybe come up with some recommendations.
SS> Another idea I just got just now is to ask key vendors and interested
SS> parties to create a cool database behind our SIG's emerging web site.
SS> --Ed (Chairman of SIG/IA)
SS> Ed also wrote:
>> Databases are a mainline concern for me at MITRE. They call me
>> "Dataman" here, and I'm in charge of developing logical data models for
>> multiple Air Force information systems that need to interoperate. The
>> problem is that different systems have different structures to store
>> similar data, making it difficult to pass data around when multiple
>> systems are deployed for the same operation.
>>
>> Stacy, I think you are on to a critical issue here: how to harness
>> database technology for web applications. As chairman of SIG/IA, I
>> don't know how to proceed to bring database folks together to discuss
>> the issues. Maybe a small conference, a database shindig for AI folks;
>> or we could plan a session at the next ASIS+T annual meeting in the
>> fall. This has a different focus from the obvious issues of web search
>> engines.
SS> sean wrote:
>>
>> I agree with everything you have stated, Stacy. And in a crazy, geeked out
SS> sort
>> of way, working in this field, to the level of multiplicity you've so
SS> aptly
>> described, has added a distinct level of apperception to my day to day...
>>
>> GOD, EVERYTHING RELATES TO EVERYTHING ELSE!
>>
>> I can't believe I actually went to college to become an illustrator...
>>
>> -sean coon
>>
>> "Surla, Stacy" wrote:
>>
>> > I'm working with database developers right now to design the back ends
SS> of
>> > two different dynamically generated subsites. While db development is
SS> not
>> > my main role, I've designed and implemented relational databases for fun
SS> and
>> > at work for many years; this improves my ability to be a diplomat among
SS> the
>> > clients, project managers, graphics designers, and db staff on these
>> > projects. (Samual Delany defined diplomacy as the ability to determine
>> > whether others have sufficient context to understand your communications
SS> -
>> > and if not, to add the necessary context as you communicate.)
>> >
>> > I find this one area of IA full of interesting, challenging, rewarding
>> > situations. To understand that what the clients want can be realized
>> > through a database - this is hard enough, because clients almost
SS> certainly
>> > do not know this themselves. To figure out how to translate (sometimes
SS> as
>> > yet undefined) content into fields and tables, enough for db developers
SS> to
>> > start to see how they might implement the database - this is quite a
>> > acrobatic feat as well. There is a new set of communication and
>> > collaboration challenges with each interface between my role and that of
>> > each of the many other disciplines involved in a web or multimedia
SS> project.
>> >
>> > I'd like to talk about the specific challenges of IA and database
>> > development. If developers have specific db questions or comments, I
SS> can
>> > refer these to my colleagues who know more about the back end than I do.
>> > I'd be curious to know what others' experiences have been.
>> >
>> > Stacy Surla
>> > Web Coordinator
>> > ONDCP Clearinghouse
>> >
>> > -----Original Message-----
>> >
>> > Vivian Bliss wrote:
>> >
>> > I was involved in the database design for a major piece of our current
>> > architecture. . . Are there others on this list involved in the backend
SS> that
>> > would be interested in chatting about "entity-relationship-entity", how
>> > powerful this could be, how it relates to term management, leveraging
SS> the
>> > system to provide intermediation, disambiguation, personalization....
>>
>> --
>>
>> -sean
>> ------------
>> call me creative, and i'll drop a tag.
>> call me Promethean, and i'll laugh.
>> call me... and i'll answer.
>> ------------
>> http://unlabeled.blogspot.com/
>> 718-369-8858
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